Longturn Forum

Posted: **Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:29 am**

Current LTex game is using as base the rules from the v2.3.2 of the mod "Civ2Civ3". Before this LTeX23B game started, we made some minor changes (for next v2.4 of the mod), to the corruption and waste caused by governments, and also to the free units supported per city, and I would suggest you to include those changes in the current game.

I tried to contact the administrators to include those changes from the beginning, but now that you are at the middle of the game, I have uploaded a patch in case you still want to introduce them. I think you will find the governments more balanced, and more differentiated, if you decide to apply this patch (Poll named govs_corruption_waste).

The table of governments that I posted in the first topic of LTeX23B already includes those changes: http://forum.longturn.org/viewtopic.php?id=150

Code: Select all

GOVERNMENTS:
------------
                  Anarch    Tribal    Despot    Monarc    Fundam    Republ    Democr    Federat   Commun   
Tax/Lux/Cie Rate  0         60        60        70        70        80        90        90        80       
Output per tile   -1(if>2)# -1(if>2)# -1(if>2)# 0         0         +1Trade   +1Trade   0         0        
Celebration Bonus (no -1)   (no -1)   (no -1)  (+1Trade)  0        (+1Trade) (+1Trade) (+1Trade)  0        
                                                                                       
Unit Upkeep       Shield    Shield    Gold      Gold      Gold      Sh+Gd     Gold      Gold      Shield   
Free Units        2\4       2\4       2\4       3\6       2\2       1\2      (1\2)      1\2       3\3      
Gold Upkeep       0         0         x1        x1        x2        x1        x2        x2        0        
Shield Upkeep     x1        x1        0         0         0         x1        0         0         x1       
Mil Unhappiness   0         0         0         -1        -1        -1        -2        -1        -1       
Martial Law       +1        0         +1        +1(Max3)  0         0         0         0         +2(Max3) 
                                                                                       
Civil war %       99        90        80        70        60        40        30        20        50       
Empire Size       0         /7        /5        /10       /6        /8        /16       /12       /14      
Special           +NoUpkeep +1 Move   +75%Gold  +50%Gold  +Tithes   +Bribe   +Brib/Sub  +Subvert  +NoUpkeep
                  -50%Lux  (Land/Mil) (Palace)  (Palace)  -50%Sci   -Revolt  -Rev/Sen   -Senate   (Cost=1) 
                  -NoTaxes                                Fanatic             Partisan            Partisan 
                                                                                        
Base Corruption   0%        30%       20%       10%       15%       25%       5%        0%        30%      
Corrup by Dist    1*        1*        1*        1*        1*        1*        1*        0*        0        
Base Waste        30%       0%        10%       20%       15%       5%        25%       30%       0%       
Waste by Dist     1**       1**       1**       1**       1**       1**       1**       0**       0

Main changes:
- Republic: Reduced Base Waste and increased Base Corruption. Else it was too hard to build units, and it was too similar to democracy.
- Monarchy: Reduced Base Corruption and increased Base Waste. Else it was too hard to research, and it was too similar to despotism.
- Communism : Number of free supported units fixed to 3 per city
- Fundamentalism: Number of free supported units fixed to 2 per city

Posted: **Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:46 am**

Ouch, it seems I can not create polls because I'm not playing the game. I sent the patch to the admins.
I will be away for some time, I wish you like the changes and you find the goverments balanced.
You surely will suggest different changes while the game advances, and you may end up with a different set of rules, but I'd like you to start with the same balance that we designed for Cvi2Civ3.

Posted: **Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:29 pm**

I read this excellent post from bardo about governments some time ago and have based my strategy on it. If these aren't the current rules for LTeX23B what are they?

Posted: **Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:23 am**

The changes affect only to the number of free units under Communism and Fundamentalism; and to the base corruption and base waste under Despotism, Monarchy and Republic. The sum is still 30% for every government, so the overal strategy should be pretty similar.

Thank you akfaew.

Posted: **Sun Jun 03, 2012 8:57 pm**

Just my thoughts on tribalism:

It doesn't seem to be balanced with Despotism and other govts. With Despotism, Monarchy, Communism you get both martial law and can build temples, etc. to make citizens content. Under Republic and Democracy, you lose martial law but gain more trade, so more luxuries, which compensates for loss of martial law. Under Tribalism, you lose martial law but get nothing to compensate for it. Either your cities choke from needing entertainers or you increase luxuries and thereby reduce science, so not as good as Despotism.

Also Tribalism seems to indicate some sort of spiritualism in the civilization. Maybe a requirement of Ceremonial Burial, Mysticism or Polytheism would be better instead of being able to build at start.

Posted: **Mon Jun 11, 2012 8:13 pm**

The main advantage of Tribalism is the extra movement of military units (it is +3 in LTex I think).
The empire size is a bit greater than Despotism, and it uses a different type of upkeep for units that could be better in some cases. In my tests, half of the AI players use to switch to tribal in the begining of the game, but I agree that human players might use it rarely.

Btw, should the government be renamed to "tribalism" in stead of "tribal"?

Posted: **Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:26 am**

Sounds like a good alternative for a rapidly expanding/exploring nation in the early phases of the game. Greater empire size so more smaller cities to avoid unhappiness problems. More movement will definitely be a military advantage if neighbors need to be eliminated and building a lot of units wont hurt economy/research with gold upkeep.
Does the extra movement apply to ships? Quite a significant advantage if it does (There are usually expensive wonders for that sort of thing).

Although I prefer monarchy myself..

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